19-10-2019, 17:07:24

Autor Tema: Ducati  (Posjeta: 12698 vremena)

0 Članova i 1 Gost pregledava ovu temu.

Offline a.m.alfa

  • Administrator
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Ovisnik o alfistima
  • *
  • Postova: 36532
  • Karma: 1310
  • Spol: Muški
  • Alfa 146 1.4ts & Lancia Musa & Alfa 155 TD & V6
    • Fiume (RI)
Ducati
« u: 04-11-2006, 18:16:47 »

Ducati DU4


Ducati has been in business for many years and has produced a wide range of products including wartime condensers, cameras, radios and obviously, motorcycles. Not many Ducat fans know that Ducati has also designed and produced prototypes for four-wheeled vehicles.

The first four-wheeled project goes back to 1946, right around the time that Ducati began production following the WWII bombing that destroyed the factory in 1944. The Ducati brothers began producing the Cucciolo (puppy) in March of ’46, but, evidently, the economic pressures of the time pushed them further towards the development of an automobile. The company designed, at least on paper, a 250 cc vehicle with a 4-speed engine. Ironically enough, this engine was a 90° L-twin cylinder and the frame was designed with trellis tubes – both just like the Ducatis of today. The vehicle was 2-seater sedan and the one-and-only prototype was born in the summer of 1946 in the Ducati plant in Milan. The vehicle was named the DU4. Unfortunately, all that Ducati has left of this project are the designs. The prototype remained in Turin for many years and now belongs to a private collector. Despite the research in to the DU4, the automobile never went into production. Perhaps this was due to the great success of the Cucciolo – so much so that the company decided not to invest in a whole new kind of product.

In 1960, Engineer Fabio Taglioni designed and built an 8-cylinder desmodromic “V“ shaped engine for Osca Maserati. Maserati, located in the eastern suburbs of Bologna, in San Lazzaro di Savena, asked Taglioni for a propulsion engine to use on a racing car, probably destined for Formula 1 racing. Although an engine was built, the project was never completed. The engine now belongs to Giorgio Monetti, a man otherwise famous at Ducati for having ridden around the world on a Ducati 175 TS with his friend, Leopoldo Tartarini.

In the early 1960s, the team “Corse Tecno” was founded by the Pederzani brothers and their headquarters were right nearby in Borgo Panigale. Although Ducati wasn’t formally involved, one of its specialised mechanics, Renato Armaroli, was a part of the team. Armaroli worked in Ducati with some of the most famous Ducati mechanics like Franco Farné, Giorgio Nipoti, Rino Caracchi and Mario Recchia.
In 1964 a new kind of 4-wheeled racing began, the Formula K, named after the world of go-kart racing. One particular vehicle that raced in the Formula K was the Tecno K, built by Tecno, a company especially famous in the late 60s and 70s for its racing success in Formula 2 championships. The Tecno team was the starting point for famous riders like Ronnie Peterson, Francois Cevert and the Swiss rider Clay Regazzoni. In the brochures of the day, the Tecno K was described as a vehicle for single brand championships, designed with a 250cc motorcycle engine produced by one of various brands including: Benelli, Aermacchi, Morini and Ducati. Soon after, Ducati became the official supplier of the single-seater propulsion karts and even today, some historians and collectors call it the “Formula Ducati”.

In 1965, while the company was under state control, the CEO, Giuseppe Montano, decided to begin producing an automobile to increase the overall production volume. Ducati worked with the British company Leyland to produce a much-loved sports car, the Triumph Herald and production began in 1965. No one knows exactly how many automobiles were built in Ducati but you can identify them by the cursive logo reading Ducati Meccanica, right below the Triumph emblem.

The next two stories linking Ducati with the four-wheeled world occurred during the most difficult years for Ducati. Despite the victories on the track and successful projects like the Pantah, Ducati management no longer believed in the production of motorcycle engines and Ducati risked becoming a company producing diesel engines for use on boats or agricultural vehicles. The production of motorcycle engines was minimal, approximately 1700 units total per year. Between 1979 and 1984, Ducati Mechanica worked closely with the company VM, located nearby in Cento, in the Ferrara province. VM hired Ducati to produce a 4-cylinder turbo diesel engine for some of the Alfa Romeo cars. This continued at least through 1988 when the Castiglioni saved the company from potential closing. The Castiglioni brothers and their great enthusiasm saved Ducati from becoming an engine storage house and nothing else and brought Ducati back to its original focus on motorcycles.

The last chapter on 4-wheeled engines is more recent and comes out of the friendship and collaboration between Ducati and Ferrari. Between 1990 and 1992 Ducati produced a V-8 cylinder automobile engine that was designed by Ferrari but produced in Ducati. This engine was used for a limited series of the Lancia Thema, the 8.32.

Tecno K, a vehicle powered by a 250cc Ducati engine



Ducati Motor Holding, SpA (Borsa Italiana:DMH) is an Italian motorcycle manufacturer located in Bologna, Italy.

From their first post-Second World War bicycle-like low-displacement motorbikes Ducati has gained prominence in motorcycle racing and in the motorcycle industry.

In the 1960s, Ducati earned its place in motorcycling history by producing the then fastest 250 cc road bike available, the Mach 1. In the 1970s Ducati began producing large-displacement L-twin (i.e. a 90° V-twin) motorcycles and in 1973 released an L-twin with the trademarked desmodromic valve design. In 1985, Cagiva bought Ducati and planned to rebadge Ducati motorcycles with the lesser-known Cagiva name (at least outside of Italy). By the time the purchase was completed, Cagiva kept the "Ducati" name on its motorcycles. In 1996, Texas Pacific Group bought for US$325 million a 51% stake in the company and in 1998, bought the remaining 49% and became the sole owner of Ducati. In 1999, TPG issued an IPO of Ducati stock and renamed the company Ducati Motor Holding SpA. TPG sold over 65% of its shares in Ducati. In December 2005 Ducati returned to Italian ownership with the sale of Texas Pacific's stake (minus one share) to Investindustrial Holdings, the investment fund of Carlo and Andrea Bonomi.
In 1926 three brothers, Adriano, Marcello and Bruno Ducati, founded Societa Scientifica Radio Brevetti Ducati in Bologna to produce tubes, condensers and other radio components, becoming successful enough by 1935 to construct a new factory in the Borgo Panigale area of the city. During the war, although the Ducati factory was a repeated target for Allied bombing, production was maintained.

Meanwhile, at the small Turinese firm SIATA (Societa Italiana per Applicazioni Tecniche Auto-Aviatorie), Aldo Farinelli began developing a small pushrod engine for mounting on bicycles. Barely a month after the official liberation of Italy in 1944, SIATA announced its intention to sell this engine, called the "Cucciolo" (Italian for "puppy," in reference to the distinctive exhaust sound) to the public. The first Cucciolos were available alone, to be mounted on standard bicycles, by the buyer; however, businessmen soon bought the little engines in quantity, and offered complete motorized-bicycle units for sale.

In 1950 (after more than 200,000 Cucciolos had been sold), in collaboration with SIATA, the Ducati firm finally offered its own Cucciolo-based motorcycle. This first Ducati motorcycle was a 60 cc bike weighing 98 pounds with a top speed of 40 mph (64 km/h) had a 15 mm carburetor giving just under 200 mpg (85 km/L). Ducati soon dropped the "Cucciolo" name in favor of "55M" and "65TL".

When the market moved toward larger motorcycles, Ducati management decided to respond, making an impression at an early-1952 Milan show, introducing their 65TS cycle and Cruiser (a four-stroke motor scooter). Despite being described as the most interesting new machine at the 1952 show, the Cruiser was not a great success, and only a few thousand were made over a two-year period before the model ceased production.

In 1953, management split the company into two separate entities, Ducati Meccanica SpA and Ducati Elettronica, in acknowledgment of its diverging motorcycle and electronics product lines. (Ducati Elettronica became Ducati Energia SpA in the eighties.) Dr. Giuseppe Montano took over as head of Ducati Meccanica SpA and the Borgo Panigale factory was modernized with government assistance. By 1954, Ducati Meccanica SpA had increased production to 120 bikes a day.

The company's offerings have improved and diversified since then.


In the 1960s, Ducati earned its place in motorcycling history by producing the then fastest 250 cc road bike available, the Mach 1. In the 1970s Ducati began producing large-displacement L-twin (i.e. a 90° V-twin) motorcycles and in 1973 released an L-twin with the trademarked desmodromic valve design. In 1985, Cagiva bought Ducati and planned to rebadge Ducati motorcycles with the lesser-known Cagiva name (at least outside of Italy). By the time the purchase was completed, Cagiva kept the "Ducati" name on its motorcycles. In 1996, Texas Pacific Group bought a 51% stake in the company for US$325 million then in 1998, bought most of the remaining 49% to become the sole owner of Ducati. In 1999, TPG issued an IPO of Ducati stock and renamed the company Ducati Motor Holding SpA. TPG sold over 65% of its shares in Ducati, leaving TPG the majority shareholder. In December 2005 Ducati returned to Italian ownership with the sale of Texas Pacific's stake (minus one share) to Investindustrial Holdings, the investment fund of Carlo and Andrea Bonomi.

From the 1960s to the 1990s, the Spanish MotoTrans company licensed Ducati engines and produced motorcycles that, although they incorporated subtle differences, were clearly Ducati-derived. MotoTrans's most notable machine was the 250 cc 24 Horas (Spanish for 24 hours). A 285 cc version of this bike won the Barcelona twenty-four-hour race at the Montjuic circuit for three consecutive years, 1956 to 1958.

Motorcycle designs

Ducati is best known for high performance motorcycles characterized by large capacity four-stroke, 90-degree L-twin engines featuring a desmodromic valve design. Modern Ducatis remain among the dominant performance motorcycles available today partly because of the Desmodromic valve design, which is nearing its 50th year of use. Desmodromic valves are closed with a separate, dedicated cam lobe and lifter instead of the conventional valve springs used in most internal combustion engines. This allows the cams to have a more radical profile, thus opening and closing the valves more quickly without the risk of valve-float which is likely when using a "passive" closing mechanisms under the same conditions.

While most other manufacturers utilize wet-clutches (with the spinning parts bathed in oil) Ducati uses multiplate dry clutches in many of their current motorcycles. The dry clutch eliminates the power loss from oil viscosity drag on the engine even though the engagement may not be as smooth as the oil bath versions, and the clutch plates can wear more rapidly.






« Zadnja izmjena: 17-04-2011, 09:30:04 od a.m.alfa »
 

Offline a.m.alfa

  • Administrator
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Ovisnik o alfistima
  • *
  • Postova: 36532
  • Karma: 1310
  • Spol: Muški
  • Alfa 146 1.4ts & Lancia Musa & Alfa 155 TD & V6
    • Fiume (RI)
Ducati
« Odgovori #1 u: 05-02-2007, 23:01:22 »
« Zadnja izmjena: 21-09-2008, 21:33:55 od a.m.alfa »
 

Fiuman

  • Gost
  • Trade Count: (0)
Odg: Ducati
« Odgovori #2 u: 05-02-2007, 23:20:13 »
jednog dana pa makar imao 100 god.  :love3:
 

Wulfy

  • Gost
  • Trade Count: (0)
Odg: Ducati
« Odgovori #3 u: 08-02-2007, 16:45:56 »
Evo malo suvoparnih podataka o svim modelima Ducatija za koje sam cuo
Poslije proizvodnje radio aparata pocinje prizvodnja motocikala
dakle evo spisak svih modela Ducatija do danas

1946 - 1951 - Cucciolo
1952 - 1958 - 98N
1953 - 1957 - 98TL
1958 - 1960 - 98TS
1959 - 1964 - 200 Elite
1961 - 1974 - 250 Scrambler
1961 - 1974 - 350 Scrambler
1964 - 1968 - 250 Mach 1
1964 - 1964 - Apollo
1965 - 1967 - 350 Sebering
1965 - 1967 - 250 Monza
1968 - 1970 - 250 Mark 3D
1968 - 1970 - 350 Mark 3D
1968 - 1974 - 350 Mark 3
1968 - 1974 - 450 Mark 3
1969 - 1970 - 450 Mark 3D
1969 - 1974 - 450 Scrambler
1971 - 1974 - 250 Desmo
1973 - 1973 - 750 S Sport
1973 - 1973 - 750 Supersport
1973 - 1974 - 125 Scrambler
1973 - 1974 - 750 GT
1974 - 1974 - 750 SS
1974 - 1976 - 860 GT
1975 - 1985 - 900 SS
1976 - 1976 - 350 GTL
1976 - 1976 - 500 GTL
1976 - 1978 - 750 SS
1977 - 1978 - 350 GTV
1977 - 1978 - 500 GTV
1977 - 1978 - 350 S Desmo
1977 - 1978 - 500 S Desmo
1977 - 1978 - 125 Enduro
1977 - 1983 - 900 SD Darmah
1978 - 1979 - 500 Panth
1980 - 1983 - 500 SL Panth
1981 - 1984 - 600 SL Panth
1982 - 1983 - 900 S2
1983 - 1983 - 350 XL
1983 - 1985 - 650 TL Panth
1984 - 1986 - 1000 S2
1985 - 1988 - 750 F1
1986 - 1990 - 750 Paso
1987 - 1987 - 650 Indiana
1987 - 1983 - 350 XL
1987 - 1985 - 650 TL Panth
1987 - 1990 - 350 F3
1989 - 1990 - 750 Sport
1989 - 1990 - 906 Paso
1991 - 1993 - 907 I.E. Paso
1991 - 1998 - 750 SS
1993 - 1993 - 888
1994 - 1994 - 900 SS C
1994 - 1997 - 916
1994 - 1998 - 900 Monster
1994 - 1998 - 600 SS
1995 - 1995 - Monster 600
1995 - 2002 - 748 (imao je redizajne ali je zadrzavao oznaku)
1996 - 1998 - 600 Monster
1997 - 1998 - 750 Monster
1997 - 2003 - ST2
1998 - 1999 - 996
1999 - 2001 - Monster 600
1999 - 2002 - 900 Supersport
1999 - 2002 - Monster 900
1999 - 2002 - Monster 750
1999 - 2007 - ST 4 (imao je redizajne ali je zadrzavao oznaku)
2000 - 2001 - 998
2001 - 2002 - Monster S4
2002 - 2005 . Monster 620
2002 - 2006 - Multistrada 1000
2002 - 2007 - 999
2003 - 2003 - 620 Sport
2003 - 2004 - Monster 800
2003 - 2004 - Supersport 800
2003 - 2006 - Supersport 1000
2003 - 2006 - Monster 1000
2003 - 2007 - 749
2003 - 0000 - Monster S4R
2004 - 0000 - ST3
2005 - 2007 - Multistrada 620
2005 - 0000 - Monster S2R
2006 - 0000 - Monster 695
2007 - 2007 - Desmosedici RR
2007 - 0000 - 1098
2007 - 0000 - GT 1000
2007 - 0000 - Sport 1000
2007 - 0000 - Hypermotard 1100
2007 - 0000 - Multistrada 1100

moguce da sam neki preskocio
Napomena: ovo su modeli za cestu
 

Wulfy

  • Gost
  • Trade Count: (0)
Odg: Ducati
« Odgovori #4 u: 08-02-2007, 16:49:31 »
Odvazni model koji zapravo nikada nije napravio komercijalni uspjeh.
DUCATI je danas poznat po... (to znamo svi)
prvi V motor u ducatiju, i to dupli L bio je u modelu koji se zvao

DUCATI APOLLO

Sredinom pedesetih u Dutati dolazi covjek sa imenom Fabio Taglioni
On je bio glavni covjek za razvoj motora u Ducatiju.
Njegov proizvod je cuveni desmodronic razvod ventila



Berliner Motor Corporation, uvoznik Ducatija za Ameriku trazio je od maticne kompanije
da naprave konkurenciju za tadasnju Harley Davidson.

Fabio Taglioni je prionuo na posao i napravljan je prvi Ducatijev V motor.
Odnosno ,,L'' (ugao izmedju cilindara 90 stepeni)



Motocikl je napravljen 1964 godine



Iz prospekta koji se pojavio kod dilera Ducatija za americko trziste:
Tehnicki podaci:
tezina: 240 kg,
mjenjac sa 5 brzina,
zapremina motora: 1260 ccm
verzija sa 2 karburatora:
80 KS pri 6000 o/min.
verzija sa 4 karburatora:
100 KS pri 7000 o/min.


 
No, ogroman problem su prestavljale gume (tezina + snaga)
tako da su morale biti specijalno konstruisane za njega.
Ima podataka da su morali smanjivati snagu na 65 KS
da bi je bezbjedno prenio na podlogu.



No sve je ostalo na pricama. Cinjenice su surove.
Osim prototipa napravljeno je jos dva komada koja su prodata.
Koliko je poznato do danas je ostao sacuvan samo jedan primjerak.
 

Wulfy

  • Gost
  • Trade Count: (0)
Odg: Ducati
« Odgovori #5 u: 08-02-2007, 16:50:48 »
Sada bi predstavio motocikl za koji mogu reci   :ling:
Zasto? Zato sto je na neki nacin pokazao da je DUCATI ziv.
U redu, godinu dana ranije pojavio se 750 F1,
ali to opet ne smanjuje moje divljenje prema sledecem modelu

DUCATI 750 PASO

Da ce to biti zaista poseban motocikl pokazivalo je i to sto je u konstrukciju Pesa umjesao prste Masimo Tamburini (inace suosnivac Bimote i konstruktor poznatih maloserijskih Bimota).
To je takodje obradovalo mnoge koji su mislili da ce Ducati od sada biti konfekcija.
To su mnigi sumnjali jer je Ducati kupila Cagiva.
U svakom slicaju u krajem Jula mjeseca daleke 1986 godine u prodajne salone stigao je Paso.

 

Motocikl je bio ono sto su novinari nazvali ,,italijansko budjenje''.
Poslije agresivnog prodora Japanaca, kada su vec svi prekrizili Ducati
fabrika izbacuje prvo 750 F1 kao konkurenta rodocelniku nove klase Suzukiju GSX-Ru 750,
pa potom i Paso, sport - tourer sa kojim bi se moglo podjednako i na pistu i na dugi put.



Motor je imao 750 ccm i razvijao je 74 KS pri 7900 o/min.
Tezina motocikla je bila svega 185 kg.
Udobnosti su doprinosile aerodinamicne oplate, kao i bogati instrumenti.



Cijena u Italiji je bila 11.203.8000 lira.
Motocikl je, po meni (znaci subjektivno misljenje), zanemaren kod mnogih kada se pominju znacajni motocikli.
Nekao je slava modela 916 potisnula kod Ducatija bilo kakvu drugu koncepciju motocikla osim sportske.
Nekako su svi zaboravili da Ducati pravio ili pravi i sport - turing, enduro (nekada popularne scramblere), naked, custom, skutere....
No, eto meni je Peso drag pa ga pominjem.



Inace prizvodio se do 1990 godine. Godine 1989 fabrika predstavlja kapacitetniji model 906 Paso koji se prizvodio dvije godine. Poslije dvije godine, odnosno, 1991 godine predstavljaju model 907 I.E. koji se prizvodio do 1993 godine. Poslije toga fabrika jedno vrijeme nije imala u ponudi sport - touring model. Godine 1997 predstavljaju model ST 2, odnosno godinu kasnije ST 4
razlika u broju ventila po cilindru (2, odnosno 4 ventila).

Danasnji model je u sustini isti kao i model koji se pojavio 1997 godine
s tom razlikom da postoje dvije varijante ST 3 i ST 4



« Zadnja izmjena: 08-02-2007, 16:52:39 od Wulfy »
 

Wulfy

  • Gost
  • Trade Count: (0)
Odg: Ducati
« Odgovori #6 u: 08-02-2007, 16:52:01 »
predhodna dva posta sam prekopirao sa nekog drugog foruma, ali posto sam ja pisao dao sam sebi tu slobodu
 

Wulfy

  • Gost
  • Trade Count: (0)
Odg: Ducati
« Odgovori #7 u: 13-06-2007, 10:38:09 »
Godina je 1993, doba rata, mrznje... (trt mrt, ovo su gluposti), ajdemo iz pocetka.

Godina je 1993 i vrijeme je da se redefinise izgled spotskog motora. Da, to je godina kada se pojavio sportski motor koji je i dan danas dizajnerski reper za mnoge danasnje sportske motore. Sledece se pojavio i na ulici.
Svi sada znate to je

DUCATI 916

Te 1993 godine model 888 (zapravo poboljšani 851) je bio ,,umoran''. Dokaz za to je pobjeda kawasakija u Superbike šampionatu. Massimo Tamburini koji je zaslužan i za već opisani Ducati Paso je dizajnirao 916.
Kažu da je to možda i najljepši sportski motocikl ikada proizveden. Uostalom zašto ga opisivati fotografije su dovoljne.





Da, ova linija je stara 15 godina.


Šta se dešava 1994 godine kada je 916 izašao na ulicu? Osim uzdaha koji izvlači od posmatrača taj motor je napravio još po nešto. Na prvoj trci Superbike šampionata je pobjedio. Vozač King Carl Fogarty.



Motor je imao zapreminu od 916 ccm i razvijao je 131 KS pri 10.500 o/min. Model za cestu je bio nešto smireniji.Godine 1995 godine mogao se kupiti i model sa sjedištem za suvozača.



Trkačka istorija modela 916 je impresivna. Kako i ne bi bila kada je osvaja šampionat iz godine u godinu.



Ciklistika, motor, izgled, tri najvažnija elementa kod motocikla su u modelu 916 uklopljeni upravo onako kako svaki motorista sa brzinom u krvi želi.



Civilni modeli 916 su:
modeli sa zapreminom motora od 916 ccm:
1994 – 1994 – 916 Strada
1995 – 1998 – 916
1995 – 1998 – 916 Senna
1995 – 1996 – 916 SP
model sa zapreminom motora od 955 ccm:
1995 – 1996 – 916 R
modeli sa zapreminom motora od 996 ccm
1997 – 1998 – 916 SPS
1997 – 1998 – 916 R
1997 – 1997 – 916 SP
1998 – 1998 – 916 Fogarty



Koliko je jak uticaj modela 916 na današnje motore vidi se po mnogim dizajnerskim elementima koji mnogi jednostavno hoce da iskopiraju ne bi li za sebe pribavili nešto harizme legendarnog 916.

 

kiki-jarun

  • Gost
  • Trade Count: (0)
Odg: Ducati
« Odgovori #8 u: 09-08-2008, 02:10:26 »
 :care  :love:



 

kiki-jarun

  • Gost
  • Trade Count: (0)
Odg: Ducati
« Odgovori #9 u: 09-08-2008, 02:12:42 »




 

kiki-jarun

  • Gost
  • Trade Count: (0)
Odg: Ducati
« Odgovori #10 u: 09-08-2008, 02:15:46 »
 :henker:



 

kiki-jarun

  • Gost
  • Trade Count: (0)
Odg: Ducati
« Odgovori #11 u: 09-08-2008, 02:17:00 »


 

kiki-jarun

  • Gost
  • Trade Count: (0)
Odg: Ducati
« Odgovori #12 u: 09-08-2008, 02:22:19 »




 

kiki-jarun

  • Gost
  • Trade Count: (0)
Odg: Ducati
« Odgovori #13 u: 09-08-2008, 02:24:11 »
 

kiki-jarun

  • Gost
  • Trade Count: (0)
Odg: Ducati
« Odgovori #14 u: 09-08-2008, 02:25:34 »
 

kiki-jarun

  • Gost
  • Trade Count: (0)
Odg: Ducati
« Odgovori #15 u: 09-08-2008, 02:26:58 »
 

adnan

  • Gost
  • Trade Count: (0)
Odg: Ducati
« Odgovori #16 u: 19-11-2008, 16:51:50 »
totalna uzivancija,hvala kiki na prosvjetljenju,uzivao sam u slikama i informacijama,ja volim i motore tako da .... ma hvala!!

a dukati kupit....... ma sam Bog zna ali nadat je se!
 

Darjan1275

  • Gost
  • Trade Count: (0)
Odg: Ducati
« Odgovori #17 u: 19-11-2008, 17:02:29 »
Ma Ducati je zakon, trese, mašina radi ko da će se raspast, kumplug melje, a dizajn :care
Serija 916/996/998/748 je i dan danas najlipši R
A vidio sam i onog Ducatija Paso, ima ga lik u sinju
 

adnan

  • Gost
  • Trade Count: (0)
Odg: Ducati
« Odgovori #18 u: 19-11-2008, 19:57:38 »
imam jednog monstera cini se 600ccm,nisam siguran ali mi finansije ne dozvoljavaju......  :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad:
 

Offline reddevill

  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Ovisnik o alfistima
  • *****
  • Postova: 9515
  • Karma: 945
  • Spol: Muški
  • 147 1.6 TS , BMW E60
    • Njemacka - Stuttgart
Odg: Ducati
« Odgovori #19 u: 19-11-2008, 19:59:30 »
C2H5OH U KRVI/ THE VARIATOR GANG